Tuesday September 21, 2004

40 Days of Community

In the past few days I have noticed a surge of interest in the 40 Days of Community program, the follow-up to the 40 Days of Purpose program some 20,000 churches have already participated in. The initial launch of 40 Days of Community is the Fall of this year, which would explain the increased interest in the program. The next launch is Spring of 2005.

While the materials for the 40 Days of Community program are not available unless your church registers, I have been able to gather the following information which will give a detailed overview of what it offers and how it functions.

What is 40 Days of Community?

It seems that few people realize that 40 Days of Purpose, the program Rick Warren created based around his mega-seller The Purpose Driven Life (approaching 20 million copies sold), was merely the beginning of his Purpose Driven campaign; it was but the first step. Where this first step of the program answered the question of ï¿½What am I here for?ï¿½ the second step extends the Purpose Driven principles to the community and asks ï¿½what are we here for?ï¿½ The third step, which will likely be initially offered in 2006, will extend the reach to the global community.

Warren describes 40 Days of Community as being ï¿½the next step in spiritual growth for your congregation.ï¿½ He also says that it is ï¿½a necessary step for deepening healthy, balanced, purpose-driven lives.ï¿½ The results for 40 Days of Purpose were so staggering that he considers it the beginning of a national revival, a new reformation and a great awakening. Among the statistics he provides for the first campaign are: average church attendance increased by 22%; average church giving increased by 20%; and average small group participation increased by 102% (while this last number is impressive, one must realize that many churches had no small group programs prior to the beginning of the program). This second step will grow Christian community and help mobilize Purpose Driven Christians to reach out to their communities ï¿½ both their faith communities and their local communities. It will grow stronger small groups and trigger new outreach and evangelism opportunities. Warren says that unbelievers are actively looking for community and when they see a church engaged in godly community, churches will have to lock their doors to keep them out.

The program is purchased from the Purpose Driven Web site (www.purposedriven.com) as a package which costs different amounts depending on the size of the church. A church of between 200 and 500 people, for example, will pay $900 for the program, though the Web site indicates that there will be additional items to purchase that are not included in that fee. I am unsure if the $900 is merely a registration fee or if it also includes the leaders guides, devotional books, etc. The program will last 40 days and will involve all aspects of the church, itï¿½s programs, worship and small groups, as well as the lives of the members of the church, as it will provide them their devotional focus, Scripture verses to memorize, and so on. Here are the components of the program:

The 40 Days of Community Kick-Off Event. This is a message preached by Warren which will be broadcast live via satellite, though churches without satellite capabilities can obtain it on DVD or VHS.
Seven weekend messages and worship plans. The messages were originally preached by Warren in his home church of Saddleback Community Church. Participating pastors are to preach his messages and employ his worship plans which direct which songs to sing. The messages are based on the book of Philippians and Warren indicates they are expository in nature. (Please note that Warrenï¿½s interpretation of what constitutes expository preaching is not consistent with what historically has been considered expository. For more, see this article).
The ï¿½What on Earth Are We Here Forï¿½ devotional book with 40 days of daily devotional readings and journaling pages. This book also includes study guides for weekly small group study.
Six small group or Sunday school lessons. These include a video which gives teaching that is then discussed by small group members.
Six weekly scripture memory verses.
Multiple church-wide events which will deepen the commitment of church members are make them active in their church and local communities..

Principles & Prerequisites

Through the 40 Days of Purpose Program, Warren discovered five principles that he says will guarantee success in the upcoming Community program. Conversely, cutting out any one of these principles will necessarily damage a campaign, curtailing the results. The principles are:

Unified Prayer ï¿½ everyone in the church must pray for the campaign beginning months ahead of time, for there is power in unified prayer.
Concentrated Focus ï¿½ The church must focus on just this one program. Multiple focuses will dilute the program and reduce its effectiveness. Each ministry and each program must carry the message of the 40 Days program.
Multiple Reinforcements ï¿½ The program depends on many reinforcements throughout the week ï¿½ church services, small groups, daily quiet times and a weekly memory verse.
Behavioral Teaching ï¿½ Each aspect of the program helps people become ï¿½doersï¿½ and not mere listeners. After each section there is a homework assignment, activity or event.
Exponential Thinking ï¿½ Exponential thinking is thinking that stretches faith. It forces leaders to look beyond what God has done before and focus instead on believing God for greater growth, greater giving and so on.

The only prerequisite for 40 Days of Community is that a church must first have completed the 40 Days of Purpose program. And, of course, they must pay the registration fee and purchase the necessary materials.

Summary

To summarize, 40 Days of Community is a comprehensive program that impacts every area of the churchï¿½s ministry for the duration of the program. Warren warns that many other programs and activities will need to be placed on hold or even cancelled if they are not part of 40 Days of Community. He advises leadership to begin to address this in advance with those ministry leaders whose areas of ministry will be affected. The program extends not just to the corporate gatherings but also to individual quiet times.

Commentary

I believe 40 Days of Purpose and 40 Days of Community are unique in the long history of the church. I cannot think of any other programs that asked a church to turn itself over completely to another pastor for the duration of a program. Warren believes the Purpose Driven principles are so important and so unique, that he asks pastors to hand them his church ï¿½ programs, messages, worship and even private devotions - for 40 days. At the end of that time he promises that the principles God has revealed to him will have transformed your church. It will be bigger (growth in numbers), be bringing in more money (growth in giving) and stronger (growth in small groups). He asks members of these churches to listen to his messages, his interpretation of Scripture, sing the songs he has chosen and study the topics he has outlined. Warren casts his vision for your church and then attempts to deliver that vision to you. The program is designed to infiltrate every important area of the church and remove those areas that are not deemed important. It is all-encompassing.

It does not require a Bible scholar to realize that there is no Biblical basis for the 40 Days of Community program. God has decreed that congregations will be led by pastors who know and love their flock. The relationship of pastor to flock is to be intimate, loving, caring, and personal. Warren, on the other hand, decrees that pastors should hand their churches to him ï¿½ to a man the pastor and members of the local congregation do not know. Warren must believe he has such an exclusive grip on truth that he is the only one who can share this truth with churches. He does not merely share principles with pastors and ask them to take these to their congregations. No, he does the teaching himself, requiring nearly every aspect of the Christian walk be directed by him for a full 40 days. His pride is overwhelming.

It is amazing that so many churches are so quick to jump on this bandwagon. It is amazing that so many pastors are willing to turn their congregations to this man.

For 7 Sundays Warren will preach in their pulpits. For 7 weeks he will teach at small groups and lead the discussion. For 7 weeks members of the congregation will memorize his chosen verses, most likely in poor translations and paraphrases. For 40 days he will provide devotional thoughts to each member of the congregation. And for 7 weeks the church will participate in the church-wide activities he suggests.

What a dark time it is for the church when pastors have so little discernment as to turn their churches to this man. What a time it is when pastors have so little confidence in their own abilities to lead their flock, and even more alarmingly, in Godï¿½s ability to provide what they need to lead their flock.

God has provided all we need in His Word. No program and no preacher can do better than the careful exposition of the Holy Bible! When we become distracted by programs and agendas, we necessarily wander from the great truth of His Word. Turn to the Word while there is still time!

Comments (31) »

1. Tim Mansell
January 22, 2006
2:03 PM

Unbelievable. Your analysis of the 40 Days of Community prgram is so far off base that I have a hard time believing you know anything at all about the Purpose Driven Life campaign. I attend a church that has completed the 40 Days of Purpose and is now working on the 40 Days of Community. Our pastor has not turned our church over to Rick Warren. All the program does is provide a format and theme for the church to work on for six weeks in a unified manner. All of the videos are completely benign, addressing only issues that are biblical and Rick Warren certainly doesn’t go out of his way to make himself or Saddleback church prominent in the process. The videos are almost of a home movie quality, certainly not a product that would be produced by someone who is vain and full of self pride. Our church still sings the songs we used before the campaign. No new Rick Warren ceations. Our pastor still preaches in the same manner as he always has. He has always provided us with an outline, with fill-in blanks for us to complete as he speaks. Yes our church is growing. From a handful 12 years ago to over 3000 on Sunday morning now. I don’t know how much of this growth could be attributed to the 40 Days campaigns. Next time before you spout off - check out the facts.

2. Rod Watts
January 24, 2006
8:31 PM

I will make my comments short as I also cannot believe the criticism that Rick Warren is receiving. A false prohet? Leading people astray from the Lord and all that? What is driving this critiicism/ It is not the Word of God. Could it be jealousy? I believe that many will have to stand before God and have to confess how wrong they were. How unloving. And all unloving. What does the Bible say? Many think that they are doing God’s work when they criticise Rick Warren and Bill Hybels. Sadly they will find out too late that they have been doing the work of Satan (like Peter). But i am sure that many are going to heaven with many thanks to these brothers in the Lord. These will be their “letters of recommendation.”

Rod Watts

3. Fred
January 30, 2006
1:08 PM

In defense of the critiques of Rick Warrens programs, I would like to say that to accept a man’s teachings uncritically is only asking for trouble. Rick Warrens is recieving criticism, from discerning people who are warning about straying from the Bible as our sole means of teaching. The PDL is using the powers of the world such as marketing, socialism, and pragmatism, along with many other such isms to evangelize the world. Though possibly well meaning , it is not Scriptural.

The Church is to minister in weakness, not strength. The strength of the world that comes from programs and marketing are not of God. It will certainly create success in worldly terms , but not many true disciples. It cant. Salvation is only found in brokeness and the end of self. In the church of the PDL , this is displayed in just the opposite manner. Salvation comes by the way of self realization, of purpose , instead of brokeness and repentance.

Rick Warren means well, but his theology is not that of the historical Gospel. Postmoderns problem is that they are viewing life only from the view of the present time. It has been said that all we can really know and understand in any true way is the past . The present is too cloudy and the future is not revealed at all. To look at life from the present is like having your nose against a mirror and trying to see your whole body.

Looking at evangelicism from the present view of time is leading to error. Though the error may be small right now, it will grow. All error is a lie , since it is not truth. A small lie always leads to a larger lie and yet another. It is a growing enity as it feeds on itself , perpetuating itself. This is the essence of evil.

Because something seems right to man , probably means it is wrong. If people are flocking into the church , then something is not right. The world is in darkness and hates the light. If this is Truth, then why is everyone coming. People are coming because they are seeking answers to their lives, but want the answers on their own terms or on terms that they will accept. They want their own autonomous lives, just fixed and meaningful. We aren’t to come to Christ for a fix, but to surrender, die to ourselves. This is not what Warren is strongly advocating for. He knows that asking one , in compliance to the Word, to completely surrender their lives will not cause people to be “driven” into the church, so he de-emphasizes this, if it is really stated at all. This is error , plain and simple. When one casualy mentions a main principle, it take away from the weight of that very principle , rendering it of casual importance , if at at all.

4. David
February 5, 2006
11:33 AM

Since when was God interested in yet another man made program. These “teachers” always seem try and convince us that their interpretation of the word is the right one.
I always believed that God was interested in developing a one to one relationship with us.
They will always argue that their programs do just that.
But do they?

5. Brian
February 7, 2006
9:39 AM

After checking out your site it is no surprise to me that you are a MacArthurite. I respect John and his opinions and scholarly study. However, his followers (you included) are some of the most critical, cynical, mean-spirited, unbiblical people I have ever met in my life. All you people spin out is whiny diatribes about how bad other people are. Why don’t you spend some time glorifying God and praising Him instead of constantly judging other people? If you spent half your energy honoring God you wouldn’t have time to critique every program and teaching that doesn’t line up with your narrow, one-sided approach to the Bible and God. You’ve been around since Jesus’ day. You’re called Pharisee. Pronounced fair—ih—see. An ancient word that has a mysterious background. But, those ‘with eyes to see’ know what it means. Grumpy Calvinists with an axe to grind on every stone. Maybe if you actually spent time praying and looking in the mirror you would see that YOU are the problem and not others.

6. Daniel Chew
February 7, 2006
11:24 AM

Perhaps those who like to defend Warren should take up their Bibles and address the many areas of concerns that a lot of us have pointed out? After all, if you call yourself a Christian, you are to obey God’s Word and follow what it says. Calling other people ‘MacArthurites’, ‘mean-spirited’, ‘Pharisee’, ad infinitum ad nauseum, and utilizing other ad-hominem measures do not help your cause, seriously. Until you do so, goodbye.

7. Tony
February 27, 2006
1:06 AM

Dear Friends,

Frankly I am deeply saddened that folks like you (peddlers of this site) have such time as you seem to have to dissect and criticize other ministers of the gospel, regardless of what you really think about them. I always thought that the great call of the Lord was to go into ALL the world and preach “the gospel to EVERY creature”.

It is so vain to spend your energy distracting those who are genuinely doing this with malicious criticisms, while you yourself do nothing for the dying souls in our generation.

I pray the Lord will have mercy on spectators like you who on the sidelines seem to know the game better than the players. The chruch definitely does not need more folks like you who abandon the Lord’s work to become magistrates like Demas….

8. Brian Thornton
February 27, 2006
8:36 AM

“It is so vain to spend your energy distracting those who are genuinely doing this with malicious criticisms, while you yourself do nothing for the dying souls in our generation.”

Mr. Mansell,
Do you realize that with these personal accusations you are doing the VERY thing which you are accusing Challies and others of doing?

Let me ask you and the other detractors here a question: Are you purpose-driven…or promise-driven? Do you live your life based on what you perceive your purpose to be, or do you live it according to what God has promised you?

There is only One who lived the purpose-driven life on this earth…Jesus Christ. He lived that life of purpose so that those He died for would live according to the promise that God declared for them to Abraham.

If YOU are living according to purposes today…you are living ultimately according to law, instead of according to gospel through the promises of God.

9. Andy P
February 28, 2006
11:02 AM

I really wish people were as excited about and hungy for the Word of God as they are for all things PD. Think about what kind of revival and reformaiton would occur in our churches if only we focused more on what the Bible says and how it directs us to live our lives and run our churches, then we would truly see people repent and embrace Jesus Christ.

I have no problems with using extra-biblical sources for insight and inspiration, and I even think there are some good ideas in PDL; however, it seems that we are all to eager to embrace the feel-good teachings of PDL and leave our Bibles to collect dust.

Rick Warren is the pastor of but one church, and not of the hundreds (or thousands) that use his sermons, etc. There is but one head of the Church, and that is Jesus Christ. We are a body of many parts, not one. God has placed pastors over their individual churches and gives them truth to speak over their individual congregations. Churches that strictly adhere to the PD initiatives are missing out what it is God wants to teach them thru their pastor and elders.

God does have a specific plan and purpose for our lives, but ultimately we exist to give glory to God and to make him known.

Isaiah 12
1Then you will say on that day,
“I will give thanks to You, O LORD;
For although You were angry with me,
Your anger is turned away,
And You comfort me.
2”Behold, God is my salvation,
I will trust and not be afraid;
For the LORD GOD is my strength and song,
And He has become my salvation.”
3Therefore you will joyously draw water
From the springs of salvation.
4And in that day you will say,
“Give thanks to the LORD, call on His name
Make known His deeds among the peoples;
Make them remember that His name is exalted.”
5Praise the LORD in song, for He has done excellent things;
Let this be known throughout the earth.
6Cry aloud and shout for joy, O inhabitant of Zion,
For great in your midst is the Holy One of Israel

2 Samuel 7
23”And what one nation on the earth is like Your people Israel, whom God went to redeem for Himself as a people and to make a name for Himself, and to do a great thing for You and awesome things for Your land, before Your people whom You have redeemed for Yourself from Egypt, from nations and their gods?

24”For You have established for Yourself Your people Israel as Your own people forever, and You, O LORD, have become their God.

25”Now therefore, O LORD God, the word that You have spoken concerning Your servant and his house, confirm it forever, and do as You have spoken,

26 that Your name may be magnified forever, by saying, ‘The LORD of hosts is God over Israel’; and may the house of Your servant David be established before You.

10. sandy r
March 2, 2006
12:00 AM

It saddens me to see so many churches accept anything that will draw a crowd. Just because there is a crowd doesn’t make it Godly. Whatever you draw a crowd with is what you have to keep it with.
The CGM is a business model, not a historical church model. Remember, it was Jesus who drove the moneychangers out and siad His house was to be a house of PRAYER, not social functions, coffee houses, trivia nights, and Christian rock concerts. Why doesn’t it concern Christians that the Purpose Driven books are so popular with unchurched lost people? After all, Jesus said that the world would hate us because it hated Him. The movement claims to be “seeker” friendly, but the Bible says that no man seeks God. If you are seeking God, it is because He God came looking for you first.
The crosses, pews, hymnals, etc are removed, they are too “churchy.” What is wrong with a church looking like a church? When were we called to conform to the world? Also, only beat driven message light songs are performed, the message is nothing that would offend a “seeker.” Therefore, the preaching of the cross, holiness, death to self and worldliness are hardly present at all. God help us as it is no wonder there will soon be a one world church under the antichrist. 45 minutes of entertainment, 15 minutes of weak watered down preaching, and 20 minutes of announcements. Can this possibly be what Jesus would want? It was Gods plan to use “the foolishness of preaching” to win souls. Jesus never, NEVER conformed to the world. He met sinners (not seekers) where they were and radically changed their lives. Jesus expected repentance. Why are we using wordly means to win the lost? What place has light with darkness, and what happens to salt when it loses it’s saltiness? It will produce nothing that is pleasing to God. Jesus said His kingdom was not of this world. To be a disciple of Jesus, one must take up their cross and follow Him daily, thus, dying to worldliness, and lusts of the flesh . Even Jesus prayed, “Father, not my will but THINE.”
I also find it odd that anyone who says Rick Warren is doing some things that are not modeled in the scriptures and people get so mad. How different this is form the Bible as well. The Bereans were commended for searching the scriptures to see if all they had been taught was true. My prayer is that we all search the scriptures and be willing to change the areas we are wrong about. The final authority is not Rick Warren but the Lord. The Bible is the wonderful inspired Word of Almighty God and was given to us so we might know Him and the way He wants things done. Times, trends and fashionable things come and go, but the Lord does not change. That is why any foundation that is layed must be on Jesus and the infallible Word of God. All else is wood, hay and stubble. My church has recently pushed heavily into this CGM and the services are not inspiring, the church has become full of sin, the sermons are vanilla and do not challenge the sinner to repent nor the saint towards holiness. The church has so many social functions and so little prayer, God help us. My husband and I may not be able to stay.

11. TheSeer
March 19, 2006
8:55 PM

I church did 40 days of community last year. From the beginning I smelled a rat. From the first video where Rick Warren announced that if you don’t have love “nothing you believe matters”, I knew I better be on the alert. Then, there were dubious reinterpretations of Scriptures. He would cherry pick from various translations to find one that would support the point he wanted to make. I’m not a KJV die-hard at all - just pick a main stream translation and stick with it. The pastor was in our small group and my wife later received a “phone call” for having questioned some of Warren’s teaching. As a co-leader of the small group, I was able to correct some, but not all, of the error by focusing the group on the Scriptures, and getting them to view what the Scripture really said.

We’ve riden through a lot of fads - Gothardism, name-it-claim-it, Prayer of Jabez, reap-what-you-sow, the Ontario revival, Promise Keepers, Brownsville hilarious giving… not that all of these were necessarily bad. Why is the church so easily taken in by the next fad? What is wrong, boring, or out of date about the Word?

12. Mary
March 23, 2006
9:30 AM

Our church just completed the 40 days of community…… and I am completely distraught and betrayed. From the very first video presentation of Rick Warren that was meant to prepare the leaders for the campaign to today, I am convinced that this campaign does nothing to further the cause of CHRIST. I am not attacking anyone, not even Mr Warren- I am just as convinced that his efforts are sincere- they are completely misguided though!
How many sincere “Christian”s will stand before Christ and have to hear- “depart from me, I never knew you.” Whoa! That should strike fear in the hearts of everyone. Unfortunalely, we dont hear about reverential fear of the Lord, the sin of humanity, our need for God and the salvation of Christ at church anymore. . What I have heard over and over and over again this past 40 days has not been the preaching of the gospel but the psychology of manmade theology ……….. The preaching of Christ has been replaced with issues and psychobabble to tickle the ears of the unrepentent. Our preacher has truly turned over the church, the worship, the music and our purpose to Rick Warrens methodology and to say otherwise( while truly subscribing to this campaign) is an outright lie.
We are being told that church service is for the seeker- (see Ricks first book, The Purpose Driven Church) and that those who already believe are relegated to small groups for edification. These groups are led by anyone willing- not ordained pastors……….This is the purpose driven model…..
Peddlers of this site need to be glad that we have our blinders off and recognize false preaching. It has taken me 3 years to recognize the false gospel of the Purpose Driven Life- I was completely sucked into it in 2002. But late last fall, as I grew up in the word, God in his perfect timing, removed the blinders and revealed to me and my husband the false Gospel of the Purpose Driven Model.
I do pray- we pray for our church and all the members and seekers that visit. I pray that the TRUE GOSPEL of Christ will be revealed to them and that we rid ourselves of all obstacles and that we return to the preaching of the TRUTH.
This is not an attack on anyone, but only a stance for the Gospel of Truth, the Gospel of the Cross, of Jesus Christ-
Will Rick Warren speak that in his next Ladies Home Journal Article?- after all he is a preacher- why hide behind self love talk when he is an ordained pastor and expected to preach the gospel at all times yet he cannot utter Jesus’ name and reason for being in a national magazine……disappointing to say the least.
I suggest anyone having any doubts about Rick Warren, and anything Purpose Driven, google his name and “40 days” and do some investigative research on your own while weighing everything against the word- It will take you only a few days to figure out his false gospel.
Wake up Church and open your eyes and hang on to your bibles-there is a battle going on. Why have we forgotten that?

13. Dallas Pymm
March 23, 2006
12:27 PM

“We are being told that church service is for the seeker- (see Ricks first book, The Purpose Driven Church) and that those who already believe are relegated to small groups for edification. These groups are led by anyone willing- not ordained pastors……….This is the purpose driven model…..”

Well said Mary. I know what you are going through. My wife and I just left our church of about 7 yrs. For the past four years they have done the PDL program each year. Two of those years they used their own book, the other two they used PDL. It was a tough thing to go through, especially when people who I had grown to love were coming down on me so harshly about my criticism of the book. Keep preaching what they are hungry for, even if they don’t kow it. The gospel is what they need, what we all need. It is sad that church has become aimed at seekers, who do not exist, and not God’s children.
I am glad my wife and I found a gospel centered church. I hope you do as well.

14. Steve Howell
May 21, 2006
8:31 AM

False gospel is right! We’re thick into 40 Days of Community and I’ve already found two instances of it.

In Day 4 of the book “Better Together” is a gospel presentation admonishing the churchgoer who is unsure of his salvation and wants to get right with God to First, Believe. There is no mention of repentance (when I complained, it was implied that those struggling with assurance of salvation didn’t need that). In place of repentance is “Believe you are not an accident…believe you were made to last forever.” The original couple were kicked out of the Garden of Eden so they wouldn’t eat from the Tree of Life. Why? So they wouldn’t live forever. These days the only one who comes close to believing that is Evil Knievel.

The rest is similar to the PDL. The reader is told to whisper the simple prayer, “Jesus, I believe you and receive you.” Warren then assures the person he is in the Kingdom of God if he prayed the prayer and was sincere.

The next few chapters seemed OK except when Warren encouraged Christians to “spend time with unbelievers.” What kind of time wasn’t specified (gambling, viewing porn, drinking?).

Then Day 12 hit and Warren quoted from The Message, 2 Corinthians 5:20, “Be friends with God; He’s already friends with you.” Whoa! Isn’t that supposed to be “reconciled”? Then Warren said, “That’s the message we are to tell the world.”
Huh? Whatever happened to God’s wrath against sinful mankind?

Before churches spend 40 Days of Community with Warren, they ought to spend a few days with Rick in his March 5 Ladies Home Journal Column. There the wolf isn’t wearing his fleece.

15. David Sorn
June 2, 2006
6:44 PM

“The next few chapters seemed OK except when Warren encouraged Christians to “spend time with unbelievers.” What kind of time wasn’t specified (gambling, viewing porn, drinking?).”

One of the major problems with churches today is that we get so wrapped up in our own supposed holiness that segregate ourselves into a “club” mentality. I’m saddened that you are shocked by Warren encouraging people to spend time with unbelievers. That’s what Jesus spent so much of his time doing…associating with the sinners and prosititutes. Like Jesus, we don’t have to “do” the same things they do, but Christians could make such a bigger difference in the world if we actually got out and spent time showing the love of Christ to unbelievers rather than only spending time with ourselves.

As far as purpose driven community goes, I believe that the concept of Biblical Christian community is one of the most neglected aspects of Biblical theology and applied ministry over the last 100 years, so I applaud Warren in trying to take the church there…it quite frankly, has a lot of growing room in this area. However, his hermenuetical and Biblical skills are certainly sad. :-)

16. steve howell
June 4, 2006
5:54 AM

Hi David,

Let me elaborate a bit on spending time with unbelievers. What saddened me about Warren’s book was that it could have specified a little more how to do this without compromising your faith. I spend time with unbelievers on my job and try to let them know where I’m coming from. As a new Christian I found this difficult and I’m certain others do too. We may not need to do the same things they do, but peer pressure is a big obstacle to overcome.

A Chinese student I once worked with spent time with his dorm roommates and was conned into getting drunk. Books like “Better Together” need to address this issue more carefully.

“Community” is the new buzzword. Biblical fellowship works just as well since it obviously includes the concept of interdependence. I have no problems with that aspect of Warren’s book so long as he sticks to good scriptural translations, but it’s all built on his shaky false gospel foundation (no repentance). And since we as believers need to remind ourselves of that gospel it’s important that we get it right.

17. Shawn
June 4, 2006
9:15 PM

I read your reviews and ask myself “why do I read this guy?”

Heaven forbid that people might be drawn to Christian Community! Especially if someone else besides the pastor is leading the cause! Actually church history tells us that other men(who were not the direct shepherd of the flock) led programs for various churches all the time. They were called “bishops”

5000 churches close their doors every day because people you who scoff at anything that is successful and outside of your paradigm.

18. Steve Howell
June 5, 2006
8:34 AM

Shawn, I don’t know if you’ve read “Better Together” yet. But it we’re to tell non-believers that God is already good friends with them, then we’re in the wrong paradigm. Mormons are “successful,” but they’re obviously in a paradigm worlds apart from the Gospel. Warren has already proved he believes repentance isn’t important enough for his “gospel” presentation in the Purpose Driven Life. I think we can see why now that we know that non-believers are already friends with God,

19. rachel middleton
June 8, 2006
10:40 PM

Steve,
Thank you for addressing the above comments with sincere Christian love. It is funny how some Christians will attack and say we should not attack our brothers like Rick Warren. I in fact think that Mr. Warren may not be a brother but a deliberate deceiver. I am sure to receive criticism for that statement. I did not always believe that he was a deceiver, only recently. The following is my experience with PDL. I have been a Christian for many years as I was fortunate enought to have a good Christian mother and come to Christ as a young child. I fell away as I got older and out on my own. I still prayed but ready by Bible precious little. My bible foundation was laid early through nightly readings from birth through highschool. I went to a Christian college my freshman year, but after that little reading in the word. I had heard many talk about PDL but just had no desire to read it. My brother is even a baptist minister and has it in his church. One day about two years ago I saw PDL in an office max with the back cover facing me. I read all the reviews from famous Christians so I thumbed through it on the shelf. “Looks biblical” I thought, so I looked to see if I had enough money to purchase it and then went to pick it up off of the shelf. As I reached for it, a voice clear as day in my ear said “Don’t pick it up, don’t even touch it.” Well my hairs stood up and I didn’t take the book. Instead I went home and called my Christian mother and asked her if she had read the book and what she thought. She said she had read part of the book but couldn’t get into it, and that it bothered her that the salvation plan was at the end of the book instead of the beginning. She said she had friends who loved the book and that my brother had the book in his church, but that she just couldn’t get into it. I pondered this and then didn’t give it another thought. Then, last year I saw Rick Warren on Larry King Live and after the hostage situation brought publicity to the book. Larry asked questions, Rick answered and referred back to the bible. Wow, I thought, this guy is different. Finally a pastor who uses scripture to answer the public media! This is great! ( I didn’t watch the whole interview) Meanwhile, I was back in church and starting to come back to my precious Jesus, whose blood paid the price of my many, many sins. Then about a month ago, I heard a radio program, just by a fluke in the middle of the night. It was the Chuck and Larry Bates program. They had Gary Kaah (not sure if spelled right) on. They were talking about Rick Warrens global peace plan. Well, needless to say every hair on my arm stood up and I recalled the last time that had happened. Every Christian who has read the Bible knows that peace on this earth will not happen until AFTER Jesus Christ returns to set up his kingdom after the tribulation and that the ANTICHRIST will come in peace. He will come in like a lamb and go out as a lion. Then I heard about Rick Warrens church telling the members not to take their bibles to the bible study. Huuuh? That is a huge red flag as the Bereans were praised for always searching the scriptures to make sure what they were being told was correct. I brought this stuff up to my brother who is a loving Christian pastor who is trying to grow a new church in the Phoenix area and uses the PDL stuff. I didn’t tell him who the pastor was who had proposed the peace plan or whose church said don’t bring your bible to the bible study. He said that the peace plan sounded really end times and scary, and that the not bringing your bible to bible study was very bad and also sounded end times. Then I told him that the Pastor doing these things was Rick Warren. He was shocked and said he just couldn’t believe it. He said RW must have been misquoted because he knew RW was solid. He said I should research it better. SO I DID….. What a shock. At first I thought that may be he was just a poor Christian to suggest a peace plan knowing what a good Berean would know about peace on earth before Christs’ return. I thought maybe he didn’t know about the bible study no bible thing. After researching, I have to say I found so much non- Christian, end-time stuff that I now do not think he could possibly be deceived but that he is indeed a bigtime deceiver, “seeking” whom he may devour. —————— Saying Fundamentalist Christians are the enemy of the 21st century, tellling missionaries trained by his team, not to tell anyone the gospel of Jesus Christ (Yes, that is true, I have heard it from two different missionaries to Africa), saying in a radio interview that to go to hell you would have to do the impossible, reject the love of God (last time I checked people were doing that right and left), saing that there was no real difference between us and Catholics ( major biblical differences, and let me clarify that if you are a catholic I am not saying you are not a Christian, I am saying that if you are a Christian and are reading your bible, you will not stay a Catholic for long), misquoting scriptures, or twisting them to mean something that is out of context to meet his agenda, having dances in his church, sex education to children as young as 3 and 4 years old (you have to come to Christ very child like, what better way to take away their innocence at a very young age and get them focused on something as facinating as sex, how inappropriate), baptising those who are living living together and unmarried, promoting this new video game that is coming out October of 2006 that has the Christians trying to convert Catholics, Jews, and Muslims to our point of view and if they don’t convert, blow them away while saying “Praise God!” or if you don’t like playing on the Christian side, you can play on the Anti-Christ side and kill the Christians. How vile and unchristian is this! ———————Needless to say, most of this I told my brother about and he justified each and every thing I told him about RW. No discernment whatsoever. It makes me very sad for him and others who have been taken in by this evil man. Yes I said EVIL. Warn anyone who will listen before we are gone. Love in Christ Jesus my Lord and Savior. Rachel

20. rachel middleton
June 8, 2006
11:26 PM

21. Steve Howell
June 9, 2006
10:03 AM

Thanks, Rachel, for your reply and encouragement. I’ve also felt that this PEACE Plan is pretty strange stuff and have spoken out about it and written to one of our assitant pastors. There simply is no mandate for solving the world’s problems. It’s all about proclaiming the Gospel, which is why it’s disturbing to hear from you that he instructed missionaries trained by his team NOT to share the Gospel. Having researched him on the internet, I’ve heard a lot of what you said, but not what you said he told the missionaries. I’ve never heard about the sex education given to children. Are you sure that’s right? Baptizing couples who are living together without the benefit of marriage is from the Saddleback website. I’ve reported that to our assistant pastor. I’m hoping to get some of Pastor Bob Dewaay’s CDs or books to our church leaders in the future.

22. Rachel
June 10, 2006
9:27 AM

Steve, You can find some information on the sex-ed just by typing in rw and sex education on a search engine and viewing different sites. Slice of Laodecia has an article, I think it’s called sex-education coming to a church near you. If you type that in with rick warren I’m sure it will come up for you. Also, as for the missionary statements, I have to say that rw’s name was tied together in an article with Bruce Wilkinson, of Jabez books, and I was under the impression that they were pushing this ministry in Africa together, where as they may have seperate ministeries there. The missionaries were for sure working with the Wilkinson group. The article with the missionaries’ comments is located on a site that I believe is called African Watch Updates. I know you can find it by typing in to a search engine, like google, African Watch or missionaries told not to preach the gospel. If you want info on the game coming out that rw is supporting, promoting you can type in rick warren and eternal forces video game. It is pretty shocking. Hope this helps. Any thank you again for your posts. Rachel

23. rachel
June 10, 2006
11:11 AM

Steve, I also have another article but will have to locate it that was in reguards to RW missions. It was by a longtime missionary who said rw’s team came in and did so much damage and with their spiritual immaturity and misinformation that it took them some time after the rw team left to get the people they had been with longterm back on the right path to Jesus. Rachel

24. J. Hancock
June 11, 2006
7:35 AM

I have to say that I agree with just about every piece of discernment regarding RWarren. I too picked up his book, way before my Church got interested and I couldn’t get interested either. Whilst I liked a couple of chapters the whole overall effect of the book left me cold. So I did the research and came up with the same conclusions as most of you have.

I have shared this information with the leadership, they didn’t want to know, and I have been passing around books dealing with this deception to the laity and they want to now know why the leadership didn’t tell them.

There is much persecution however that comes with making a stand against this stuff and my mother and I are finding out. I have left my Church of the last five years in part due to this issue.

Whilst RWarren’s teaching was kind of like the last straw, I must point out that the hearts of our leaders were already going astray and this I believe opened them up to his stuff. They have their eyes set on being ‘successful’ and not in a biblical sense. They crave to be big. They crave realestate and numbers and they mostly have no idea on how to hear the Lord’s voice for themselves (traditional Lutherans)

I believe because they had their hearts set on ‘cultural idols’ they were prime targets for deception. God afterall gives them over to their depravity, just like he did with Israel at times, so that they might finally repent after reaping the appropriate foul harvest.

The sad thing is however is the damage this does to sincere but immature Christians. They are not being fed and prepared for the tribulation and persecution which is quickly coming to the Christian Churces in the West. Rick Warren is feeding ‘fairy floss’ to the sheep and they will not stand in end times on this diet. What I would like to see more of on sites like this is prayer. Let us pray for these leaders. Let us pray that they get a real vision of God’s holiness and the foul state of our sin. Let us pray that God gives them a taste of true repentance like what was experienced in the real revival of Wales.

He is a brother after all, even though very misguided and he needs the ‘real intercessors’ to pray.

God Bless

25. J. Hancock
June 11, 2006
7:41 AM

Oops i forgot to mention two good books which deal with some of this. This little Church went to market by Gary Gilley he really summed up what i have been feeling for a long time. And Fools Gold edited by J McArthur. Os Guinness is quoted very frequently in this book and is another good author on this topic.

Also A time of Departing (cant remember the author and my book is out doing the rounds) , but this can be found at light house trails. Also a good read.

As I am a theology student i would appreciate hearing if anyone else has some good resources they can reccomend for my further study.

26. Steve Howell
June 11, 2006
9:34 AM

I recommend “Redefining Christianity” by Pastor Bob Dewaay. He had to study PDL in seminary and has done his research. You can listen to some pretty insightful interviews at Pastor Bob Dewaay Critical Issues.

What disturbs me about his analysis is that he says Warren knows how to exegete the Bible, yet chooses to present improper exegesis and proof texted stuff to his readers. Warren’s speeches at the UN and the Aspen Institute where he brags about his “success” instead of preaching Christ makes me wonder if he hasn’t sold out to enemies of the Gospel somewhere on his spiritual “journey.”

I think Warren already knows about the “foul state of our sin” yet he refuses to proclaim it. The question we should all be asking is Why?

27. Francisco
June 11, 2006
7:00 PM

This transcript is not too old (just late Christmas) and it can be eye-opener : L. King interviews Warren

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0512/02/lkl.01.html

28. Steve Howell
June 12, 2006
9:21 PM

L. King interviews Warren
You’re right. I can’t believe my eyes.

Warren: …”and I think God says, in fact, he makes very clear in the Bible, you want to be my child, I’ll take anybody who chooses me.”

Matthew 7:22-24: “Many will come to me on that day, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and in your name drive out demons and perform many miracles?’ Then I will tell them plainly, ‘I never knew you. Away from me you evil doers.’”

King: “Does God love you if you don’t believe in Christ?”

Warren: “God loves everybody. There’s no doubt about that. He’ll never stop loving you.”

Jeremiah 23:17 (about false prophets): “They keep saying to those who despise me, ‘“The Lord says: ‘You will have peace.’ And to those who follow the stubborness of their hearts they say, ‘No harm will come to you.’

Warren is clearly a false prophet.

29. Rachel Middleton
June 15, 2006
2:14 AM

Warren: …”and I think God says, in fact, he makes very clear in the Bible, you want to be my child, I’ll take anybody who chooses me.”

Bible: …But we ought always to thank God for you, brothers loved by the Lord, because from the beginning GOD CHOSE YOU to be saved through the sanctifying work of the Spirit and through belief in the truth. HE CALLED YOU to this through our gospel, that you might share in the glory of our Lord Jesus Christ. 2Thessalonians 2:13-14

God chooses us, God calls us.

Warren: …. “God loves everybody. There’s no doubt about that. He’ll never stop loving you.”

Bible: …. “I have loved you,” says the Lord. “But you ask, “How have you loved us?” “Was not Esau Jacob’s brother?” the Lord says. “Yet I have loved Jacob, BUT ESAU I HAVE HATED, and I have turned his montains into a wasteland and left his inheritance to the desert jackals.”……….They will be called the Wicked Land, a people always under the wrath of the Lord.

Hmmmm, is Warren even reading the Bible? And when he gives quotes, they are often misquotes or out of context. His interpetation is often off mark. Since the Holy Spirit guides us in understanding the Holy Word, one must question whether or not he is being guided by the Holy Spirit. I do not say this lightly. I am sincere in my concern over this man.

30. jane
June 15, 2006
10:03 AM

Dear Rachel,
You have every reason to be concerned. The PDC methods are driving devout Christians out of churches and filling them with tares. The PDC is actually like a reinvention of the Social Gospel of the early 20th century.

31. Steve Howell
June 16, 2006
3:06 AM

Rick Warren, the new champion of community, has said some more disturbing things on his website. Regarding those who resist his church growth methods, he said, “I’m saying some people are going to have to die or leave. Moses had to wander around in the desert for 40 years before God killed off a million people before he let him go into the Promised Land.”

http://www.pastors.com/RWMT/default.asp?id=263&artid=4533&expand=1
See also Sliceoflaodicea.com if this doesn’t work.

So a pastor with a church full of dissenters can rationalize taking his flock down a rabbit trail until they die off or leave in frustration? Then he can justify this by saying God told me to do it? Sounds monstrous!