A Senseless Conflict? (Part 2)
A couple of days ago I responded briefly to an article that appeared in Scientific American (link). I did not attempt a thorough defense of creationism that would convince a person who was committed to evolutionism. I sought primarily to show that the argumentation used was, at best, high school level, and that the arguments were easily answered. This article, though, triggered other thoughts and I wanted to discuss something I’ve written about before: the fact that naturalism is a religion all its own. As a long-time Christian - one who never experienced adulthood without knowing God and who had the privilege of being raised in a Christian home - it is often difficult to understand what people raised with a secular mindset think and believe and why they think and believe those things. Said tersely, it has proven difficult to truly understand the postmodern mindset. Through my studies, however, I have made some observations that I believe accurately represent this mindset. It is to one of those that I wish to turn today.
There is a realization that has dawned on me slowly that concerns Naturalism which I will treat as being near-synonymous with Darwinism. In short, Naturalism is the belief that the natural world as we know and experience it is all that exists. To put this in religious terms, we could say that Naturalism teaches that ultimate truth does not depend on supernatural experiences, supernatural beings or divine revelation; instead it can be derived from the natural world. Perhaps Carl Sagan expressed this most clearly in his Cosmos series which he prefaced with the statement “The universe is all that is or ever was or ever will be.” Naturalism is a belief that is firmly embedded in our society. The field of science wants nothing to do with a Creator or a universe that has been intelligently designed. Naturalism is taught as law in the school systems and is held as being objective truth. Religious beliefs, values and morals are thought to exist on a separate, subjective level that should not be held us universally true. Science is objective truth and exists in a public realm; values are subjective beliefs that exist in a private realm. The late Christopher Reeve, in discussing groundbreaking research techniques that were condemned by some religious leaders as being amoral, said that religious beliefs can have no place at the table when discussing science, thus indicating his belief that science is more objective and more universally true than religion. Again, science is public fact whereas values are private beliefs. Those beliefs may be important to the individual, but they are not grounded in nature and hence should not extend beyond the individual. This bifurcated system (a fact/value dichotomy) is inseparable from the postmodern mindset.
What dawned on me a year or two ago is that Naturalism, as it is ingrained in the postmodern mindset and in the educational system, is far more than an explanation as to the origins of the world. Naturalism is a full-blown worldview, and in reality, is a religious system that stands in direct opposition to Christianity. One does not need to look far today to find Naturalists that make this admission. Michael Ruse, a well-known evolutionist says “evolution came into being as a kind of secular ideology, an explicit substitute for Christianity…Evolution is a religion. This was true of evolution in the beginning, and is true of evolution still today.” (Nancy Pearcey, Total Truth, page 172)
Perhaps at this time it would be helpful to define the term “worldview.” Nancy Pearcey, in Total Truth says “[E]ach of us carries a model of the universe inside our heads that tells us what the world is like and how we should live in it. We all seek to make sense of life. Some convictions are conscious, while others are unconscious, but together they form a more or less consistent picture of reality.” This is a worldview. Lifeway, a company that develops Christian curricula, says a worldview is “The composite set of presuppositions, beliefs, and values a person possesses that shape how he or she sees reality and determines how he or she will act. It refers to the collective set of fundamental convictions people hold and on which they base their actions.” Using these definitions, we can understand that there are varying worldviews available to us. We can see also that a person’s worldview begins to be shaped from the moment he is born, as presuppositions and unconscious convictions combine with conscious beliefs and values to form a worldview that form a “more of less consistent picture of reality.” Thus a person experiences reality through his worldview which serves as a lens to interpret and understand life. We must conclude that a worldview shaped by Naturalism, where nature is all that is, was or ever will be, must be diametrically opposed to a worldview shaped by Christian principles which teach that God is the eternal, self-existent One who created and sustains the universe.
I work in the field of computers and we often use the hyphenated suffix “killer” to describe new software or hardware. For example, the operating system Linux was considered by some to be a Windows-killer in that it provided a better but incompatible alternative to Microsoft’s Windows operating system and many believed that it would soon relegate Windows to the trash heap of history. Recently Mozilla’s Firefox has been deemed an Internet Explorer-killer because it provides a better alternative to the competing browser. This provides an apt metaphor for Naturalism, as it has become for many people a Christianity-killer. The theories of evolution, which are simply poor science, have been extended to frame an entire worldview that is directly opposed to the worldview of the Bible. Consider just two examples.
Marriage, according to the Bible, is a divinely-mandated institution and forms the very building block of society. It is not an institution God created in response to the corruption of men, but was embedded even in a perfect world. In a perfect world which God had declared to be very good, He said that it is “not good for man to be alone.” Thus He created woman to complete man and joined them in the marriage bond. A Naturalistic belief system stands in stark contrast to this. After all, if marriage is not mandated by God, it must exist only as a human institution and one that survived the process of natural selection. In other words, it exists because we have invented it and found that it worked well for us in the past. As we continue to evolve and develop we are learning that it may no longer be in our best interests to emphasize marriage relationships. Thus when we view marriage merely as a human institution we are free to enter into it, reject it, or adapt it however we see fit.
Let’s look at sexuality in the light of Scripture and Naturalism. The Bible teaches that sexuality is a gift from God, and once more, something that existed in perfection, before sin entered the world. The Scriptures further teach that sexuality is a gift that must be used in a certain manner; it is appropriate only for a man and woman within the covenant bonds of a marriage relationship. Sex is a beautiful expression of love and oneness - a gift from God to build and strengthen marriage relationships. Naturalism sees sex in an entirely different light. Sexual relationships are derived from human origins and sexual normalcy is associated with a specific culture and time. Normalcy is what works for a specific group at a specific time and is not rooted in any type of divine law. Thus when homosexuality becomes celebrated in our society, it is an expression of Naturalism.
Those who argue against homosexuality or other expressions of deviant sexuality, generally do so from the grounds of values, but Naturalists have already relegated values to a secondary realm of the subjective, where Naturalism is an expression of objective fact. Those who stand for traditional views of marriage where the institution is reserved for a man and a woman, similarly speak of values, but again, values have no objective meaning to those fully absorbed in a Naturalist worldview.
The fact is, naturalism is a complete worldview and a religion unto itself. To attempt to reconcile Darwinism, naturalism and evolution with Christianity is akin to reconciling Christianity and Islam. It simply cannot be done. As I wrote in the first article, The true conflict, the conflict between evolution and creationism, is a conflict of truth and error, a conflict of God and man. Creationism embraces God as the Creator and Sustainer of the world; evolutionism rejects God replaces Him with time, chance and opportunity. The debate between creationism and evolutionism is by no means senseless, for it is a defense of the truth and a defense of the One who is Truth.




Comments (25) »
1. Si
September 28, 2006
11:27 AM
I consider myself a creationist, yet I struggle with the statement that the theories of evolution are ‘poor science’. The theories of evolution are I think, generally an attempt to account for the existence of life according to the remit of science. It does this very well, in that it gives a model for the coming into existence of life according to the scientific evidence. However, it ignores the possibility of there being a different order of evidence which fits outside of that framework. So I think it is wrong to describe evolution as bad science, according to any normal definition of science, but the theories are potentially symptomatic of science being the sole isolated framework through which people view the world (ie naturalism/materialism).
I think there is also a danger (and this is possibly the origin of Shermer’s view of a watchmaker God) of a Christian knee-jerk reaction against “chance” - ie. a view that a scientific model involving chance and a view of a creative God are mutually incompatible. There are many things that occur that we can rightly attribute to “random chance” - tossing coins and throwing dice being the archetypes of such events. And yet, “The lot is cast into the lap, but its every decision is from the LORD.” This shows a broader context for the scientific model.
I agree that evolution is often a weapon for a secular ideology, but arguing the science whilst the scientific evidence isn’t available too often leaves creationism open to accusations of crankism, and generally ends up with science of about the same quality as Shermer’s attempts at theology.
2. Joshua
September 28, 2006
11:52 AM
Hi SI,
Thanks for your thoughts on this subject. However, I don’t believe that anything can rightly be attributed to “random chance”. And not simply because God sovereignly controls all things. Even from a human perspective, there is nothing that is truly chance.
The examples you gave of “random chance” were tossing a coin or rolling dice. However, if I placed a coin in exactly the same spot on my finger, flipped with the same motion, at the same speed, with the same power, with all of the atmospheric conditions the same, etc … it will always land on the same side. The reason it seems random to us is that we aren’t able to account for all of these different variables. So even from our perspective, there is no force called “random chance” that effectively works on our coin tosses or dice rolling. It is simply our lack of knowledge that brings about surprise when we get a ‘head’ or a ‘tail’ or some number on die.
3. Lance Roberts
September 28, 2006
11:57 AM
There is a lot about evolutionary theory that is bad science. A case in point it carbon dating, which has a few major flaws, the worst being that it’s based on an assumption that the world is many millions of years old. Without that assumption it falls like a house of cards.
4. Aaron
September 28, 2006
12:02 PM
Joshua said: It is simply our lack of knowledge that brings about surprise when we get a ‘head’ or a ‘tail’ or some number on die.
That is a very interesting statement. I had not thought of the sovereignty of God in light of this before. The reason humans speak of “chance” is basically because of our own ignorance. There is no chance with God because he knows all things. Thanks for the comment!
(P.S. Tim - your preview post page is a very hard to read color)
5. Si
September 28, 2006
12:10 PM
Hi Joshua,
The motion of particles due to their energy (heat), even given identical atmospheric conditions would be random. I agree that common sense would suggest that everything could be predicted if the system’s starting conditions were known, however humanist scientists attempts to define the universe as clockwork and determinstic based on this assumption failed, due to the realisation that there is randomness inherent in the universe.
6. Matt C.
September 28, 2006
1:42 PM
“Naturalism is a full-blown worldview, and in reality, is a religious system that stands in direct opposition to Christianity. “
I remember when I first heard this theory presented in Francis Schaeffer’s works years ago. It completely changed the way I looked at the world’s different views and philosophies. Of course now this idea of naturalism/ liberalism/secularism is more popular with even the likes of Ann Coulter theorizing as much, but it is fundamental in understanding western culture today.
7. Michael Garner
September 28, 2006
2:39 PM
a Christian knee-jerk reaction against “chance” - ie. a view that a scientific model involving chance and a view of a creative God are mutually incompatible. There are many things that occur that we can rightly attribute to “random chance” - tossing coins and throwing dice being the archetypes of such events. And yet, “The lot is cast into the lap, but its every decision is from the LORD.”
I think that this is an interesting point. We have to remember that “chance” is not an active force (despite the way people sometimes use the term). If we flip a coin, we say that there is a 50-50 chance that it will land Heads. However, “chance” here is simply reflecting the odds - it isn’t actually CAUSING anything. If we knew the height of the flip, the force of the flip, the wind conditions, etc., then we could figure out how it would land. The laws of nature (that is, the laws God has ordained and sustains in nature) are what is at work. That is the Active force.
In this way, even things that appear “random” or “by chance” can be controlled by God. As long as we remember that “chance” is not an active force that is causing anything, then I think we are okay. So, for example, What does TIME plus CHANCE equal? Absolutely nothing.
Does this mean that God cannot use random mutations that appear to be chance? Obviously. We can clearly see how God uses micro-evotion / adaptation. These seemingly result in chance (as some are positive and some are negative).
So, Must Christians have a knee-jerk reaction against things that appear to be driven by chance? Of course not. But, Must our Christian perspective of what “chance” is and what “chance” can cause be informed by a Christian wordlview grounded in Scripture? Absolutely.
8. Tim Challies
September 28, 2006
2:49 PM
“Even from a human perspective, there is nothing that is truly chance.”
I have to agree with this. I don’t think anything in the universe can be said to be truly random. It may appear to us that way, but Scripture seems to confirm that God controls even what seems random.
9. JRush
September 28, 2006
3:16 PM
Sproul has a terrific discussion on Chance in his book Not a Chance. The point is that Chance is no-thing. It is nothing. It has no causative power. Chance does not “do” anything. It is a soft-pillow on which Naturalists can slumber.
Science is now, by definition, Naturalism in most minds. The popular culture is also trying to make “Democracy” inherently naturalistic. Hence, if Christian values are codified into law through the election process—they still call it theocracy because they don’t want to live under those values. But if they push their naturailstic world-view through the election process—that’s democracy. If Christians use their 1st Amendment rights to protest a direction, that is now called “being divisive.”
When you can frame the debate by determining the definitions—that’s power.
Naturalism is undermining the church. We breathe it in the air and drink it in the water. Lewis said it is in our bones.
JRush
10. 4ever4given
September 28, 2006
4:12 PM
So essentially naturalism is sin nature in its comfort zone.
11. kletois
September 28, 2006
7:18 PM
Lance, that’s the first time I’ve seen someone say carbon dating is based on the assumption that the Earth is millions of years old. Where do you get this from? Carbon dating is based on isotope half-life, which is the time taken for half the mass of the isotope material to become the daughter isotope through radioactive decay. Anyone with a physics background knows that this technique is useful for dating material which is only several thousand years old, and then there are errors cited in the date determined.
12. chizadek
September 28, 2006
9:21 PM
I think care needs to be taken to distinguish between methodological naturalism (MN), which is the principle that science seeks naturalistic explanations (it would not work otherwise), and philosophical naturalism (PN), which is the belief that only the natural exists. It is not appropriate for science to accept PN as true, and scientists when speaking as scientists should not make comments regarding whether the supernatural exists, though some do make comments based on their personal belief in PN (eg. Dawkins). Many scientists while they hold to MN are also theists and so obviously reject PN.
Also in science calling something random does not imply purpose or lack of purpose behind it, just that it follows some probability distribution, the ultimate cause of which is an issue outside of science.
I think the problem is that though science does not take a position on PN, for many people the distinction between MN and PN is lost and they believe that science assumes PN. I don’t think it is helpful to promote this false view of science, though PN itself should be challenged.
13. mclarko
September 28, 2006
11:19 PM
chizadek - Using your definitions of PN and MN, I would have to say that the difference is lost on many scientists…. namely the ones that get the spotlight. These people believe they’re always speaking as scientists, and the media and teachers unions have gone along with their bias for the past 40 years. The effect of this is that more and more folks looking to reject any sort of supernatural involvement in their lives, have latched on to the PN worldview.
science seeks naturalistic explanations (it would not work otherwise)
I take issue here because if the goal of science is to seek truth, then it shouldn’t matter if the answer is perceivably natural, or imperceptively natural, i.e., supernatural…. as long as it’s logical.
So, to boil it down, it’s the scientists themselves that are promoting this false view of science.
14. Caleb
September 28, 2006
11:43 PM
In a Way of the Master episode, Kirk Cameron interviews a young woman who is an atheist, and who believes in evolution. She says, “We have theories that prove…”
Theories that prove??? That’s evolution in a nutshell.
As Ray Comfort says, “It takes more faith to be an atheist than to be a Christian.”
15. Jerry Morningstar
September 29, 2006
12:07 AM
Interesting discussion
I like to think that we as Christians are not opposed to science - just bad science. I think the distinction between pn and mn is a good one. We can debunk science all we want - but we still rely upon it when we go to the doctor’s and take their pill or whatever. i.e. we trust many of the findings of mn.
Where science goes astray is when it oversteps its bounds as to what it can factually prove.
Sagan’s quote - ‘The universe is all there is, was, ever will be.’ is a good example
That is just bad science. He cannot prove that. It’s pn. He would have to be able to sweep the universe to make sure there is no God out there and his statement is correct.
The same is true on much that is said about origins. I can grant a big bang. When God spoke creation into existence - there probably was a big bang. But - science cannot prove that God was not behind it. It’s a philosophical assumption to rule out a creator.
It’s a faith based claim [an illogical one at that] - to believe that rational, moral creatures evolved from non-rational, blind forces
Where the issue becomes more sticky - I believe in a young earth - and I have to use my philosophical theism to override methodological naturalism.
Is this legitimate? It is if you believe in miracles and that there is a God who stands outside of and over nature who can suspend the laws of nature when it suits His purpose. That is exactly the God described in Scripture. i.e. the virgin birth, water into wine, etc.
I would love to see some stronger young earth arguments from a mn standpoint. However - the testimony of Scripture is good enough for me because God was the only one there and who can tell us what happened.
16. Custard
September 29, 2006
6:33 AM
There seems to be a straw man argument here.
Yes, evolution is an essential part of naturalism. But that does not mean that naturalism is an essential part of evolution.
It is possible to be a consistent Christian who also believes that evolution is the means by which God created living beings, each according to its kind.
17. Jerry M
September 29, 2006
7:25 AM
I’m not sure I see what is being referred to as a straw man. However - I don’t believe it’s possible to be a consistent Christian and believe that God used macro-evolution in the process of creation.
Macro evolution suggests the process of life slowly graduating to higher forms of life over millions of years eventually resulting in man.
We are told in the Scriptures that death entered the world thru Adam’s sin. [rom. 5:12]
You can’t have death and decay going on for millions of years before Adam’s sin from a biblical stand point.
Macro evolution requires the process of death and decay over millions of years supposedly before there was an Adam or the fall into sin.
The scientific community itself is somewhat flustered over the lack of intermediate links between species in the fossil record. That is why they have begun to postulate the theory of ‘punctuated equilibrium’. This theory states that many species came into existence all at once followed by a long period of equilibrium. Then after a period of time - another great jump occurred. i.e. the fossil evidence does not even come close to supporting the huge baggage that macro evolution has tried to hang on it.
18. Si
September 29, 2006
11:03 AM
There’s a tremendous danger in this “science is bad” talk. I believe that God created me to enjoy His creation - to glorify Him for what He has done and is doing. That results in many desires in me and other of my species - and one of these is to understand the way that the world works - the processes and natural mechanisms. These processes and mechanisms are GOOD, they were made that way. And this desire, at root, is GOOD. Science, to the extent of trying to undertand the mechanisms in our universe, is GOOD. Science, despite some reports to the contrary, is not at root an orchestrated conspiracy to destroy Christianity. There are, however, some scientists (Dawkins being one of the most prominent) who do use science as an attempt to confirm their worldview (natrualism/materialism/humanism). The atmosphere of “science is bad” is leading to a disengagement from science amongst Christians, which is certainly a shame, and unhelpful to the cause of promoting Jesus in a world that does recognise the right merits of science at the same time as listening to the distorted worldview of some scientists.
Our knowledge and understanding of our environment comes from two sources: revelation from God, through His Word, which can be seen as “top-down”; and our experiences from the natural stimuli around us, which can be viewed as bottom-up. To have a coherent view requires these two views to “interface”. Yes, the top-down view should definitely take precedence, however, Psalm 19:1 calls us to take note of our universe and the message it brings to us. I don’t claim anything like perfect understanding looking from either direction(!) but neither the naturalistic evolution theories nor the young earth or intelligent design “science” explanations do create a good interface between theology and scientific observation.
The Bible tells me that God saw what He had created and said that it was good. I am sure there are innumerable aspects to this “goodness”, but I consider a strong candidate to be that there is a “coherence” in God’s creation. The universe “works” on the small scale and the large scale of space and time. It requires God’s constant upholding - but to use a car as a metaphor it doesn’t need God to either turn the key (deism) nor does it need him to put his foot on the throttle/gas. Rather, it needs his activity if it is going to have any existence full stop. It also needs his activity for all of the laws of thermodynamics, pressure etc. that it’s operation depends on. There seems to be a relentless effort amongst Christians to latch onto what seems like it might be some unbridgable gap in either the fossil record or science’s explanations of the universe and say “Aha - we told you! God does exist - there He is!”.
We are in danger of missing out on the amazing fact that our universe is understandable to us; that there is an amazing amount of regularity; that the universe generally works according to laws. Many scientists and philosophers have pointed out that there is no reason why the universe should be like this, that the most inexplicable aspect of the universe is that it is to humans fairly explicable. Schaeffer, who was mentioned earlier in this conversation, would know doubt have pointed out that this is symptomatic of us being created in the image of the universe’s creator.
God is constantly at work in His creation. Much of the time he works in predictable ways, according to laws. These laws cannot be separated from His activity in His creation (I do not mean by this a form of pantheism - merely that the laws cannot continue apart from His activity). We generally call these laws nature. Sometimes God works in a way beyond these “laws” and this predicability - and we refer to these works as supernatural. Neither of these is a distinct intervention on His part, but a continuation of God’s activity. I know many will struggle with this distinction between natural and supernatural, like my thoughts on chance (ie. that a system can from the bottom up display “chance” and still have a teleology (ie God) from the top down) - however, I don’t think it is in any sense contradictory to say that a process obeys “laws” and also to say that it obeys God. It is simply that the law obeys God.
19. Lance Roberts
September 29, 2006
11:47 AM
If you take differential equations you can see the type of equation that carbon dating is based on. There is a constant ‘k’ that has to be known to solve this, and ‘k’ is solved for by making an assumption that a certain item is a specific age, They assumed an age in the million years range for some item to arrive at the value of the constant. I was blown away when I was taking DiffyQ and understood the assumption, though I’ve since seen it pointed out (along with carbon datings other fallacies) at the website for the Institute of Creation Research. They have thousands of articles showing how Science can be understood through a Christian Worldview.
20. Lance Roberts
September 29, 2006
11:56 AM
Custard,
As Jerry M pointed out, there was no death before the fall. Christianity and Evolution (macro) are mutually exclusive belief systems.
21. Custard
September 29, 2006
12:51 PM
Show me how you know for certain that “death” in Romans includes death of animals. Coz it looks to me as if the argument goes that all die in Adam. Well, my dog isn’t in Adam - it’s a different bit of creation. It’s people who are in Adam, so who die as a result of Adam’s sin. Just as it’s people who are in Christ as so who are freed from death by being in Christ. Chickens don’t die in Adam then get made alive in Christ.
I’m not an evolutionist.
Here’s a model: Animals evolve (directedly) into protohumans (in the 6th yom); God intervenes to change a mortal protohuman into an immortal human - Adam (maybe even physically identical to him as a protohuman); Adam sins, Adam becomes mortal; his descendants are also mortal. I don’t see that that conflicts with Scripture.
22. Bob
September 29, 2006
1:51 PM
In regard to human origins, I believe any forced marriage between Biblical creationism (the ages-old religious belief) and macro evolution (the relatively newborn “scientific” theory) takes an enormous amount of… faith. (I’m trying to be tactful here.) It requires more faith, I think, than merely believing in either atheistic evolution or Biblical creationism.
How shameful that in the midst of this discussion, so many rational people will not address the elephant in the room — the fact that evolution can’t be proven. The theory has, indeed, has been shot full of holes at every turn over the last century so that it must itself evolve rapidly to survive as a coherent theory.
Despite what my high school and college teachers would suggest (rather, did suggest to me), the alleged evolution of humans and/or primates is not capable of experimental verification. Application of the scientific method to experiments on present-day animals and plants cannot prove evolution. At best, the scientific method could only be used to demonstrate the “possibility” or “plausibility” of human evolution.
Furthermore, methodological flaws in the interpretation of the human fossil record reveal its artificial and arbitrary arrangement. In short, evolutionists have routinely manipulated the raw data of scientific discovery to advance their theory. Many claims of discoveries used to shore up evolutionary theory have been debunked (i.e. Piltdown Man, Rhodesian Man, Neandertal Man, etc.)
By contrast, evolutionary scientists have yet to propose a cohesive, unified theory that fits all the available facts — * without ignoring inconvenient ones * — that does not also require enormous leaps of faith.
Could an omnipotent God have used evolution? Sure, hypothetically. He could have done anything.
But from a Biblical standpoint, there is simply no text one can point to that truly suggests an old earth or God’s use of macro evolution.
A hybrid creation / evolution, or God-directed evolution, has nothing behind it but wild conjecture.
23. Custard
September 30, 2006
2:46 AM
And that’s why I’m not an evolutionist.
24. Glenn Piper
September 30, 2006
11:00 AM
Science in and of itself is NOT bad, just as a knife is not bad in and of itself. In both cases it is the use it is put to that determines whether good or bad comes into it. As to evolution (molecules to man), there is NO scientific proof for evolution at all, nothing. It is a faith based on a desire to exclude God at any cost. There is much scientific evidence that points towards a young earth. I would recommend anyone here who wants to peruse said evidence themselves to go to the AIG website www.answersingenesis.org There you will find scientists who beleive firmly in the word of God and in a young earth + a literal 6 days of Creation. It is a huge site with huge amounts of data and articles.
25. Dex
September 30, 2006
11:10 PM
Tim,
Thanks for the post. Most naturalists/evolutionists would go screaming into the night if you suggested that their beliefs about God (or the lack thereof) constitute a “religion”. They are very comfortable with a definition of religion that says “if you believe in God, that is a religion, if you don’t, then that is not a religion”. Why, how could they use the legal system to silence Christians and at the same time promote their beliefs if their beliefs were considered to be “religious” as well? What about the unfortunate wording of “separation of church and state”. If you redefined the meaning of religion to include atheists and philosophical naturalists, then any group that promoted these beliefs could be called a “church” and excluded from unduly influencing the government in the same way that Christians have been. People like Eugenie Scott and Richard Dawkins could be considered “church leaders”, and while still given their religious freedom, they would have to be publicly ridiculed and misrepresented by the media. The ACLU would have to oppose their own presence in a court room. But, if you can control the definition of terms, then you can take a legal system based on Christian principles and use it to remove those same principles from itself. No, I think “unreligious” are very happy with the rather selective way that these terms are defined. It allows them to have their cake and eat it too. They are the state church that is not a church.